1 00:00:22,390 --> 00:00:09,100 welcome to the skeptic zone the podcast 2 00:00:29,990 --> 00:00:24,890 yes it's the skeptic zone podcast 3 00:00:31,970 --> 00:00:30,000 episode number 546 for the well it's 4 00:00:33,340 --> 00:00:31,980 sort of the 7th of April I'll get back 5 00:00:38,680 --> 00:00:33,350 to that in a minute 6 00:00:42,860 --> 00:00:38,690 2019 Richard Saunders here with you from 7 00:00:44,930 --> 00:00:42,870 okay so all right there is no 7th of 8 00:00:48,460 --> 00:00:44,940 April this year for me personally and 9 00:00:50,420 --> 00:00:48,470 I'm somewhere somewhere over the Pacific 10 00:00:54,590 --> 00:00:50,430 about to cross the International 11 00:00:59,119 --> 00:00:54,600 Dateline which means I go from the 6th 12 00:01:00,680 --> 00:00:59,129 of April to the 8th of April go figure 13 00:01:03,439 --> 00:01:00,690 that one out coming up on this week's 14 00:01:05,510 --> 00:01:03,449 show regardless we have an interview 15 00:01:07,160 --> 00:01:05,520 with Kate Carter from the National 16 00:01:09,650 --> 00:01:07,170 Center for science education 17 00:01:11,870 --> 00:01:09,660 Kate is the director of community 18 00:01:14,540 --> 00:01:11,880 science and she's involved with many 19 00:01:17,540 --> 00:01:14,550 wonderful things very interesting video 20 00:01:19,580 --> 00:01:17,550 projects that explain some of what she 21 00:01:21,650 --> 00:01:19,590 does are available online links in the 22 00:01:24,770 --> 00:01:21,660 show notes and she knows an awful lot 23 00:01:27,590 --> 00:01:24,780 about wisdom teeth that's Kate Carter 24 00:01:28,969 --> 00:01:27,600 coming up at the top of the show after 25 00:01:32,420 --> 00:01:28,979 that it's Heidi Robertson the raw 26 00:01:34,460 --> 00:01:32,430 skeptic with a smelly story from New 27 00:01:37,969 --> 00:01:34,470 Zealand about aromatherapy and essential 28 00:01:41,539 --> 00:01:37,979 oils something does not smell right in 29 00:01:43,719 --> 00:01:41,549 New Zealand it's on the nose can we say 30 00:01:47,390 --> 00:01:43,729 that alternative medicine wrapped around 31 00:01:51,230 --> 00:01:47,400 pseudoscience stinks oh it goes on and 32 00:01:54,830 --> 00:01:51,240 on this story involves a school that was 33 00:01:58,190 --> 00:01:54,840 was passed hence using essential oils to 34 00:02:00,859 --> 00:01:58,200 calm the children and make them better 35 00:02:04,730 --> 00:02:00,869 then to round off the show a timely 36 00:02:07,240 --> 00:02:04,740 story the timely story it's 30 years 37 00:02:09,530 --> 00:02:07,250 this year since the first 38 00:02:12,949 --> 00:02:09,540 mind/body/spirit or mind/body wallet as 39 00:02:16,039 --> 00:02:12,959 we call it festival appeared in Sydney 40 00:02:18,080 --> 00:02:16,049 or was staged in Sydney and 30 years ago 41 00:02:20,630 --> 00:02:18,090 Tim Mendham the current editor of the 42 00:02:24,050 --> 00:02:20,640 skeptic magazine journal from Australian 43 00:02:26,750 --> 00:02:24,060 skeptics attended mind/body/spirit and 44 00:02:29,420 --> 00:02:26,760 wrote a report and that report we will 45 00:02:32,539 --> 00:02:29,430 bring you this week and I happen to know 46 00:02:34,670 --> 00:02:32,549 Tim Mendham just in the last couple of 47 00:02:37,900 --> 00:02:34,680 days attend 48 00:02:42,230 --> 00:02:37,910 the current mind-body-spirit festival a 49 00:02:45,290 --> 00:02:42,240 big shout-out to my friend Yein Lu who I 50 00:02:48,740 --> 00:02:45,300 used to work with Oh many years ago with 51 00:02:51,440 --> 00:02:48,750 Stefan Stefan soika who is the other 52 00:02:55,040 --> 00:02:51,450 co-host of the skeptic zone from time to 53 00:02:58,250 --> 00:02:55,050 time Stefan and I were the original 54 00:03:00,890 --> 00:02:58,260 hosts of the skeptics and of course but 55 00:03:05,000 --> 00:03:00,900 many years ago yin and I worked with 56 00:03:07,310 --> 00:03:05,010 Stefan and ye Inge who is now based in 57 00:03:10,060 --> 00:03:07,320 San Francisco who bought me a wonderful 58 00:03:13,910 --> 00:03:10,070 lunch the other day is the creator of 59 00:03:19,010 --> 00:03:13,920 the fail whale used by Twitter the 60 00:03:21,710 --> 00:03:19,020 famous picture of the whale being lifted 61 00:03:25,160 --> 00:03:21,720 into the sky by lots of little birdies 62 00:03:26,750 --> 00:03:25,170 or a wonderfully talented artist and I 63 00:03:29,240 --> 00:03:26,760 had the pleasure of a private tour of 64 00:03:31,850 --> 00:03:29,250 some of her collection well that's 65 00:03:34,160 --> 00:03:31,860 enough from me at the moment stay tuned 66 00:03:36,740 --> 00:03:34,170 at the end of the show for another 67 00:03:39,500 --> 00:03:36,750 announcement or to some upcoming events 68 00:03:42,020 --> 00:03:39,510 but now it's time for me to run upstairs 69 00:03:45,290 --> 00:03:42,030 and have another bowl of that delicious 70 00:04:10,390 --> 00:03:45,300 San Francisco clam chowder well I do 71 00:04:15,649 --> 00:04:13,160 once again I find myself in beautiful 72 00:04:17,870 --> 00:04:15,659 downtown Oakland California at the 73 00:04:19,909 --> 00:04:17,880 offices of the National Center for 74 00:04:21,800 --> 00:04:19,919 Science education I've been visiting the 75 00:04:24,890 --> 00:04:21,810 National Center science education now 76 00:04:27,529 --> 00:04:24,900 for for many years since 2004 mainly to 77 00:04:29,090 --> 00:04:27,539 speak to our friend dr. eugenie Scott 78 00:04:31,400 --> 00:04:29,100 but today I'm going to be speaking with 79 00:04:35,659 --> 00:04:31,410 the director of community science 80 00:04:37,159 --> 00:04:35,669 education Kate Carter hello Kate hi how 81 00:04:39,110 --> 00:04:37,169 are you doing this afternoon 82 00:04:40,490 --> 00:04:39,120 this just gone afternoon I'm doing very 83 00:04:42,529 --> 00:04:40,500 well it's wonderful to be here we're 84 00:04:45,680 --> 00:04:42,539 sitting in the library and I'm like 85 00:04:47,990 --> 00:04:45,690 gazing around and what a collection I've 86 00:04:50,990 --> 00:04:48,000 never seen such a wonderful including 87 00:04:52,839 --> 00:04:51,000 skulls including skulls on the in the 88 00:04:56,420 --> 00:04:52,849 bookshelf Darwin Darwin Darwin 89 00:04:59,659 --> 00:04:56,430 creationism evolution over here it's 90 00:05:01,640 --> 00:04:59,669 it's quite something No is this a dream 91 00:05:04,279 --> 00:05:01,650 job for someone like you to work at such 92 00:05:07,719 --> 00:05:04,289 a facility absolutely 93 00:05:10,040 --> 00:05:07,729 I left academia after a postdoc and 94 00:05:12,050 --> 00:05:10,050 transitioned to something where I could 95 00:05:13,939 --> 00:05:12,060 really work directly with the public so 96 00:05:16,520 --> 00:05:13,949 I get to share my enthusiasm for 97 00:05:18,950 --> 00:05:16,530 evolution with a really wide audience 98 00:05:20,480 --> 00:05:18,960 and what's your doctorate in exactly my 99 00:05:23,719 --> 00:05:20,490 doctorate is in human evolutionary 100 00:05:27,020 --> 00:05:23,729 biology hmm so I worked on the evolution 101 00:05:30,560 --> 00:05:27,030 of wisdom teeth oh right I good to talk 102 00:05:33,080 --> 00:05:30,570 to you I had a miserable time in my 103 00:05:35,210 --> 00:05:33,090 mid-30s with wisdom teeth 104 00:05:37,700 --> 00:05:35,220 oh my goodness me I had to have three 105 00:05:38,420 --> 00:05:37,710 out at once huh what's the deal with 106 00:05:42,050 --> 00:05:38,430 wisdom teeth 107 00:05:43,850 --> 00:05:42,060 so my first question to you is did you 108 00:05:47,689 --> 00:05:43,860 only have three or did you have all four 109 00:05:50,089 --> 00:05:47,699 I had four one was taken out in advance 110 00:05:52,310 --> 00:05:50,099 it was a bad one and had a big hook on 111 00:05:54,620 --> 00:05:52,320 it oh and it was hooked it was 112 00:05:56,270 --> 00:05:54,630 incredible I had it out in the chair and 113 00:05:57,830 --> 00:05:56,280 then I think the dentist took pity on me 114 00:06:00,560 --> 00:05:57,840 and I had to rest out under general 115 00:06:02,450 --> 00:06:00,570 anaesthetic oh wow okay so you're not 116 00:06:04,190 --> 00:06:02,460 first of all if you only have three 117 00:06:08,060 --> 00:06:04,200 wisdom teeth I would say that that was 118 00:06:11,330 --> 00:06:08,070 the rarest condition so most people have 119 00:06:14,710 --> 00:06:11,340 zero or four but three is the the most 120 00:06:18,590 --> 00:06:14,720 rare so you're not special in that way 121 00:06:20,690 --> 00:06:18,600 but a lot of times so when you talk 122 00:06:22,670 --> 00:06:20,700 about the evolution of wisdom teeth the 123 00:06:25,270 --> 00:06:22,680 first thing that happens when you talk 124 00:06:28,880 --> 00:06:25,280 to the general public is they think that 125 00:06:31,430 --> 00:06:28,890 humans and primates didn't have their 126 00:06:34,100 --> 00:06:31,440 third molar but it turned out and that 127 00:06:35,420 --> 00:06:34,110 humans have evolved its special run and 128 00:06:39,590 --> 00:06:35,430 so that's where you have to start with a 129 00:06:41,870 --> 00:06:39,600 lot of people but it is actually mammals 130 00:06:43,850 --> 00:06:41,880 started off early mammals had four 131 00:06:44,260 --> 00:06:43,860 molars and we've been gradually losing 132 00:06:49,270 --> 00:06:44,270 them 133 00:06:51,890 --> 00:06:49,280 so humans actually have two or three and 134 00:06:53,720 --> 00:06:51,900 what we think is going on and what I've 135 00:06:57,250 --> 00:06:53,730 showed that was going on in in my 136 00:07:00,080 --> 00:06:57,260 dissertation is we really soft foods 137 00:07:02,780 --> 00:07:00,090 relative to what you what you might 138 00:07:04,340 --> 00:07:02,790 think a chimp and a gorilla eat a chimp 139 00:07:07,760 --> 00:07:04,350 and a gorilla actually can spend eight 140 00:07:10,220 --> 00:07:07,770 hours of their day chewing so just 141 00:07:12,590 --> 00:07:10,230 imagine if from instead of nine to five 142 00:07:15,460 --> 00:07:12,600 you're at work if nine to five was spent 143 00:07:17,450 --> 00:07:15,470 just chewing leaves because of the 144 00:07:20,150 --> 00:07:17,460 coarseness and the toughness of that 145 00:07:21,740 --> 00:07:20,160 yeah right so because we switch to 146 00:07:25,310 --> 00:07:21,750 softer foods we don't spend as much time 147 00:07:26,260 --> 00:07:25,320 chewing and our dolls are smaller than 148 00:07:29,360 --> 00:07:26,270 they used to be 149 00:07:30,980 --> 00:07:29,370 so we have a much higher rate of wisdom 150 00:07:33,110 --> 00:07:30,990 tooth impaction and so what you 151 00:07:39,920 --> 00:07:33,120 experience is the downside of wisdom 152 00:07:43,250 --> 00:07:39,930 tooth impaction and so because impaction 153 00:07:45,530 --> 00:07:43,260 can actually be pretty pretty nasty and 154 00:07:47,150 --> 00:07:45,540 before the rise of antibiotics and 155 00:07:48,710 --> 00:07:47,160 before modern dentistry if you had an 156 00:07:52,550 --> 00:07:48,720 impacted wisdom tooth you were pretty 157 00:07:54,680 --> 00:07:52,560 much down for the count as soon as it's 158 00:07:56,480 --> 00:07:54,690 swelled up in the back of your jaw it 159 00:07:57,770 --> 00:07:56,490 could very easily move to your throat it 160 00:08:01,850 --> 00:07:57,780 turns out breathing and eating are 161 00:08:05,030 --> 00:08:01,860 pretty important to staying alive so 162 00:08:08,540 --> 00:08:05,040 very often what we would see is that if 163 00:08:11,090 --> 00:08:08,550 you have populations eating softer foods 164 00:08:13,340 --> 00:08:11,100 the individuals with to is sorry two 165 00:08:14,690 --> 00:08:13,350 teeth two molars would do much better 166 00:08:16,840 --> 00:08:14,700 than the individuals with three molars 167 00:08:19,040 --> 00:08:16,850 so it's natural selection in action 168 00:08:21,060 --> 00:08:19,050 really only a couple hundred years ago 169 00:08:23,490 --> 00:08:21,070 that's interesting to say I mean 170 00:08:25,410 --> 00:08:23,500 was horrible and and listeners out there 171 00:08:26,130 --> 00:08:25,420 who have had wisdom teeth problems know 172 00:08:29,090 --> 00:08:26,140 what we mean 173 00:08:31,290 --> 00:08:29,100 but you to but I never I never really 174 00:08:32,940 --> 00:08:31,300 took the time to think well what 175 00:08:35,490 --> 00:08:32,950 happened if they weren't taken out I 176 00:08:38,130 --> 00:08:35,500 would simply think I'd still have pain 177 00:08:41,490 --> 00:08:38,140 but no no it could get a lot worse yeah 178 00:08:43,640 --> 00:08:41,500 so abscesses I don't know if yours got 179 00:08:47,040 --> 00:08:43,650 to the point where they were obsessed 180 00:08:49,170 --> 00:08:47,050 mine um one of mine did so I can speak 181 00:08:52,500 --> 00:08:49,180 from experience it is a terrible amount 182 00:08:54,570 --> 00:08:52,510 of pain and so an abscess is an 183 00:08:57,540 --> 00:08:54,580 infection and especially on the upper 184 00:08:59,430 --> 00:08:57,550 part of your mouth if you get an abscess 185 00:09:01,590 --> 00:08:59,440 it can very easily cross them to the 186 00:09:03,690 --> 00:09:01,600 sinus and cross them to the and go 187 00:09:05,220 --> 00:09:03,700 straight to the brain which infections 188 00:09:08,310 --> 00:09:05,230 in the brain are never a good thing in 189 00:09:11,400 --> 00:09:08,320 the lower jaw very often infections can 190 00:09:13,470 --> 00:09:11,410 spread to the the throat and so you can 191 00:09:16,350 --> 00:09:13,480 end up with basically a swollen throat 192 00:09:18,420 --> 00:09:16,360 that won't won't allow you to breathe so 193 00:09:21,300 --> 00:09:18,430 I suppose there was quite a deal of our 194 00:09:24,900 --> 00:09:21,310 ancestors who had an unhappy end with 195 00:09:27,390 --> 00:09:24,910 the wisdom teeth that's correct so and 196 00:09:28,860 --> 00:09:27,400 if you made it past early childhood 197 00:09:31,200 --> 00:09:28,870 where there are lots of ways for you to 198 00:09:33,000 --> 00:09:31,210 die before antibiotics and if you 199 00:09:35,100 --> 00:09:33,010 survived to the point where if you 200 00:09:37,260 --> 00:09:35,110 reached your 18th birthday which not a 201 00:09:41,790 --> 00:09:37,270 lot of people did back then that was yet 202 00:09:44,940 --> 00:09:41,800 another way that you could die or it 203 00:09:47,330 --> 00:09:44,950 would a teary topic to you now and I I 204 00:09:49,650 --> 00:09:47,340 also had the a very unfortunate 205 00:09:52,560 --> 00:09:49,660 unpleasant condition of dry socket which 206 00:09:54,810 --> 00:09:52,570 you probably know about yeah yeah well I 207 00:09:57,480 --> 00:09:54,820 don't want to make our listeners feel 208 00:09:59,280 --> 00:09:57,490 too bad but anyway let's talk about what 209 00:10:01,530 --> 00:09:59,290 you do here the director of community 210 00:10:02,100 --> 00:10:01,540 science education what does that mean 211 00:10:04,410 --> 00:10:02,110 exactly 212 00:10:06,480 --> 00:10:04,420 so I think of my role and this is kind 213 00:10:07,860 --> 00:10:06,490 of highfalutin and silly is really 214 00:10:09,600 --> 00:10:07,870 breaking down barriers between a 215 00:10:13,140 --> 00:10:09,610 scientist in a non scientist 216 00:10:15,440 --> 00:10:13,150 so a lot of times especially in the u.s. 217 00:10:18,660 --> 00:10:15,450 there are people who are just really 218 00:10:23,100 --> 00:10:18,670 they're not naive to science they're 219 00:10:24,810 --> 00:10:23,110 just opposed to science hmm and when we 220 00:10:28,290 --> 00:10:24,820 because we work a lot in the Midwest 221 00:10:30,090 --> 00:10:28,300 when we think about why that is a lot of 222 00:10:31,830 --> 00:10:30,100 times we see people who have had really 223 00:10:35,100 --> 00:10:31,840 negative experiences with science as a 224 00:10:38,240 --> 00:10:35,110 kid maybe they had a teacher that 225 00:10:42,120 --> 00:10:38,250 called on them and made them feel stupid 226 00:10:44,940 --> 00:10:42,130 maybe they you know their parents were 227 00:10:46,290 --> 00:10:44,950 you know opposed to science there's lots 228 00:10:49,470 --> 00:10:46,300 of different reasons that people can get 229 00:10:52,710 --> 00:10:49,480 turned off to science and so we're 230 00:10:54,960 --> 00:10:52,720 really interested in kind of helping 231 00:10:56,509 --> 00:10:54,970 people realize that there's not a 232 00:11:00,269 --> 00:10:56,519 fundamental difference between 233 00:11:02,490 --> 00:11:00,279 scientists and non-scientists we all eat 234 00:11:04,949 --> 00:11:02,500 breakfast and brush our teeth and do 235 00:11:08,910 --> 00:11:04,959 normal things and we actually think 236 00:11:11,400 --> 00:11:08,920 about things in much the same way so 237 00:11:13,769 --> 00:11:11,410 even people who are opposed to science 238 00:11:15,210 --> 00:11:13,779 if you've talked to them you can pick 239 00:11:18,780 --> 00:11:15,220 apart how they're actually thinking 240 00:11:20,940 --> 00:11:18,790 scientifically and as an aside it's a 241 00:11:22,560 --> 00:11:20,950 great way to if someone is really anti 242 00:11:23,819 --> 00:11:22,570 science it's a great way to undermine 243 00:11:28,110 --> 00:11:23,829 them by being a little that's a great 244 00:11:29,819 --> 00:11:28,120 hypothesis you said well you seem to be 245 00:11:33,600 --> 00:11:29,829 using evidence to support a conclusion 246 00:11:36,030 --> 00:11:33,610 oh wow you're doing science you may hate 247 00:11:39,449 --> 00:11:36,040 it but that's what you're doing 248 00:11:41,340 --> 00:11:39,459 that's interesting and so what I do is I 249 00:11:45,420 --> 00:11:41,350 spend a lot of time trying to work in 250 00:11:46,860 --> 00:11:45,430 populations that are they have a greater 251 00:11:49,829 --> 00:11:46,870 percentage of people who are opposed to 252 00:11:52,350 --> 00:11:49,839 science to try and really break down 253 00:11:54,360 --> 00:11:52,360 that kind of divide yeah you make an 254 00:11:56,579 --> 00:11:54,370 interesting point here because I've 255 00:11:58,440 --> 00:11:56,589 always considered that a lot of people 256 00:12:01,470 --> 00:11:58,450 simply ignorant of the scientific method 257 00:12:03,449 --> 00:12:01,480 what science is in the skeptical 258 00:12:05,069 --> 00:12:03,459 community will get people from the New 259 00:12:06,690 --> 00:12:05,079 Age quite often looking at us in saying 260 00:12:09,510 --> 00:12:06,700 well science can't explain everything 261 00:12:11,250 --> 00:12:09,520 can it so they're ganging yeah which to 262 00:12:14,040 --> 00:12:11,260 us means they don't understand really 263 00:12:16,370 --> 00:12:14,050 what they're talking about so but you're 264 00:12:18,750 --> 00:12:16,380 suggesting a lot of people simply aren't 265 00:12:20,670 --> 00:12:18,760 ignorant of the scientific method and 266 00:12:24,210 --> 00:12:20,680 why it's here and what it does but just 267 00:12:27,290 --> 00:12:24,220 opposed to it on principle yeah I mean I 268 00:12:29,579 --> 00:12:27,300 believe and this is a belief not 269 00:12:32,610 --> 00:12:29,589 supported by a huge amount of evidence 270 00:12:34,500 --> 00:12:32,620 I'm gonna flag that up here that most 271 00:12:38,160 --> 00:12:34,510 children are born thinking like 272 00:12:41,610 --> 00:12:38,170 scientists so when you are building with 273 00:12:43,650 --> 00:12:41,620 blocks you learn gravity by knocking 274 00:12:46,350 --> 00:12:43,660 things over you do repeated experiments 275 00:12:48,060 --> 00:12:46,360 and then you come up with a theorem and 276 00:12:48,960 --> 00:12:48,070 then later on you learn that that's 277 00:12:50,429 --> 00:12:48,970 called gravity and 278 00:12:54,540 --> 00:12:50,439 you learned some numbers attached to it 279 00:12:57,059 --> 00:12:54,550 but you the way that we reason with the 280 00:13:00,059 --> 00:12:57,069 world is using is is through a 281 00:13:02,490 --> 00:13:00,069 scientific context now it's imperfect 282 00:13:04,350 --> 00:13:02,500 and they're certain there are certain 283 00:13:07,470 --> 00:13:04,360 ways that people can take advantage of 284 00:13:11,059 --> 00:13:07,480 our reasoning to lead us to believe all 285 00:13:14,910 --> 00:13:11,069 sorts of silly things but in general we 286 00:13:17,240 --> 00:13:14,920 we reason through like scientists and 287 00:13:19,650 --> 00:13:17,250 even people who are opposed to it 288 00:13:21,360 --> 00:13:19,660 they're opposed to it not because of the 289 00:13:23,220 --> 00:13:21,370 underlying fundamental principles of 290 00:13:24,869 --> 00:13:23,230 science but they're opposed to it 291 00:13:26,819 --> 00:13:24,879 because some sort of silly political 292 00:13:33,929 --> 00:13:26,829 dressing that has been put on top of the 293 00:13:36,829 --> 00:13:33,939 science scaring so so what are we what 294 00:13:39,840 --> 00:13:36,839 are you doing here at the center to help 295 00:13:41,129 --> 00:13:39,850 negate that I mean I know that for 296 00:13:44,009 --> 00:13:41,139 example and I was just having a quick 297 00:13:46,889 --> 00:13:44,019 look before you are engaged in making a 298 00:13:48,629 --> 00:13:46,899 very interesting series of videos but 299 00:13:50,970 --> 00:13:48,639 the videos have a point and they talk 300 00:13:51,929 --> 00:13:50,980 about things like the science Booster 301 00:13:53,939 --> 00:13:51,939 Club what's that all about 302 00:13:55,170 --> 00:13:53,949 sure so the science Booster Club is one 303 00:13:57,929 --> 00:13:55,180 of the three things that we're doing to 304 00:14:02,129 --> 00:13:57,939 try and bring science into the community 305 00:14:06,299 --> 00:14:02,139 and every month it's kind of like a blue 306 00:14:08,910 --> 00:14:06,309 apron for your for science where we send 307 00:14:10,199 --> 00:14:08,920 all of our clubs a kit run do it 308 00:14:12,179 --> 00:14:10,209 yourself do it yourself 309 00:14:16,019 --> 00:14:12,189 so you add sometimes you have to add 310 00:14:17,910 --> 00:14:16,029 water so now if you have to add sand but 311 00:14:21,420 --> 00:14:17,920 we send pretty much all of the all of 312 00:14:23,939 --> 00:14:21,430 the interesting things and you open up a 313 00:14:28,079 --> 00:14:23,949 box and you can do a science activity 314 00:14:30,929 --> 00:14:28,089 Wow so we this month I guess this is 315 00:14:33,569 --> 00:14:30,939 April now when March we did a nitrate 316 00:14:35,549 --> 00:14:33,579 activity talking about how the effects 317 00:14:39,150 --> 00:14:35,559 of climate change will change the 318 00:14:41,100 --> 00:14:39,160 effects of nitrate pollution which for 319 00:14:43,679 --> 00:14:41,110 us living in a city here is not super 320 00:14:46,920 --> 00:14:43,689 relevant but if you're a farmer in Iowa 321 00:14:49,049 --> 00:14:46,930 that is a very big thing and this month 322 00:14:51,509 --> 00:14:49,059 we're doing an activity about the heat 323 00:14:54,090 --> 00:14:51,519 island effect in cities which is called 324 00:14:56,249 --> 00:14:54,100 cool cities where you actually build a 325 00:14:59,519 --> 00:14:56,259 little model city an ice cube trays and 326 00:15:01,769 --> 00:14:59,529 then heat it up so what just just for my 327 00:15:02,519 --> 00:15:01,779 benefit a heat island what does that 328 00:15:05,939 --> 00:15:02,529 mean exactly 329 00:15:09,059 --> 00:15:05,949 so because we are in an urban area and 330 00:15:11,639 --> 00:15:09,069 the things that we use to build 331 00:15:16,050 --> 00:15:11,649 buildings and roads they tend to absorb 332 00:15:19,290 --> 00:15:16,060 a lot of heat and not so much in Oakland 333 00:15:22,470 --> 00:15:19,300 but certainly in big cities that don't 334 00:15:23,910 --> 00:15:22,480 are not beside a body of water it tends 335 00:15:25,319 --> 00:15:23,920 to get really hot in the summer because 336 00:15:26,850 --> 00:15:25,329 the city is absorb heat and don't 337 00:15:28,079 --> 00:15:26,860 release it as much and there are a lot 338 00:15:30,600 --> 00:15:28,089 of different things there are a lot of 339 00:15:34,769 --> 00:15:30,610 different reasons behind that mm we are 340 00:15:36,840 --> 00:15:34,779 trying to help people find architectural 341 00:15:39,689 --> 00:15:36,850 solutions and city planning solutions 342 00:15:41,939 --> 00:15:39,699 for mitigating the effects so it's a way 343 00:15:43,110 --> 00:15:41,949 of taking the climate change argument so 344 00:15:45,119 --> 00:15:43,120 it's not we're not having an argument 345 00:15:46,970 --> 00:15:45,129 about climate change the presupposition 346 00:15:49,829 --> 00:15:46,980 of the activity is that it's happening 347 00:15:50,850 --> 00:15:49,839 but we're helping people find solutions 348 00:15:53,100 --> 00:15:50,860 to deal with it 349 00:15:55,410 --> 00:15:53,110 and so what we know is that once people 350 00:15:57,150 --> 00:15:55,420 find success once people can be 351 00:15:59,579 --> 00:15:57,160 successful at finding a solution to 352 00:16:02,369 --> 00:15:59,589 climate change they kind of brand 353 00:16:03,960 --> 00:16:02,379 themselves as on the side of it even if 354 00:16:06,780 --> 00:16:03,970 if you had asked them before they did 355 00:16:09,600 --> 00:16:06,790 the activity they would have said oh I 356 00:16:11,639 --> 00:16:09,610 don't really know about that I see seven 357 00:16:14,400 --> 00:16:11,649 and what age groups are you really 358 00:16:16,920 --> 00:16:14,410 looking at all ages we're really looking 359 00:16:20,040 --> 00:16:16,930 at all ages and so we actually create 360 00:16:22,139 --> 00:16:20,050 the activities with you know different 361 00:16:25,110 --> 00:16:22,149 modifications for different age groups 362 00:16:25,980 --> 00:16:25,120 so that we can really reach you know 363 00:16:33,749 --> 00:16:25,990 what 364 00:16:35,699 --> 00:16:33,759 schoolers and so there are different 365 00:16:37,710 --> 00:16:35,709 ways of modifying the activity to really 366 00:16:39,900 --> 00:16:37,720 resonate with with each age group and 367 00:16:41,460 --> 00:16:39,910 what and I was just looking also I've 368 00:16:43,290 --> 00:16:41,470 seen the walk like a chip you did with 369 00:16:44,879 --> 00:16:43,300 dr. eugenie Scott that's that's that's 370 00:16:46,619 --> 00:16:44,889 great I thought that was really 371 00:16:49,889 --> 00:16:46,629 interesting but funny at the same time 372 00:16:50,220 --> 00:16:49,899 and this rising tides what's that all 373 00:16:53,579 --> 00:16:50,230 about 374 00:16:55,049 --> 00:16:53,589 so sea-level rise is a big problem and 375 00:16:58,410 --> 00:16:55,059 we're very much worried about it when 376 00:17:01,559 --> 00:16:58,420 you look throughout the next 50 to 100 377 00:17:04,880 --> 00:17:01,569 years if you do an activity and you go 378 00:17:08,760 --> 00:17:04,890 out into the community and you say 379 00:17:10,889 --> 00:17:08,770 you're terrible did you know you're 380 00:17:12,360 --> 00:17:10,899 contributing to climate change and these 381 00:17:15,120 --> 00:17:12,370 are all the bad things that are gonna 382 00:17:16,169 --> 00:17:15,130 happen mm-hmm what people some people 383 00:17:17,579 --> 00:17:16,179 listen 384 00:17:19,019 --> 00:17:17,589 but most people stick their fingers in 385 00:17:22,949 --> 00:17:19,029 their ears and go about their business 386 00:17:26,759 --> 00:17:22,959 who are you go away yeah so what we do 387 00:17:29,220 --> 00:17:26,769 instead is we say hey I bet you can help 388 00:17:31,859 --> 00:17:29,230 us come up with a solution so we place 389 00:17:36,419 --> 00:17:31,869 these little plastic monopoly houses on 390 00:17:38,580 --> 00:17:36,429 a beach and we say can you design a way 391 00:17:39,810 --> 00:17:38,590 to keep this house dry because the sea 392 00:17:41,070 --> 00:17:39,820 level is gonna rise and it's gonna 393 00:17:43,619 --> 00:17:41,080 really affect this house 394 00:17:46,019 --> 00:17:43,629 and so with young kids we just let them 395 00:17:48,090 --> 00:17:46,029 build but for older kids we say hey and 396 00:17:51,239 --> 00:17:48,100 you also have to think well you're gonna 397 00:17:54,359 --> 00:17:51,249 be working on a budget but also you know 398 00:17:57,720 --> 00:17:54,369 you're paying for premium you know 399 00:18:00,960 --> 00:17:57,730 oceanfront views so if your idea was to 400 00:18:03,899 --> 00:18:00,970 put a big wall which is which is a very 401 00:18:07,379 --> 00:18:03,909 effective way takes down the property 402 00:18:09,539 --> 00:18:07,389 value of the monopoly house so that's 403 00:18:13,049 --> 00:18:09,549 not gonna work so we have them not just 404 00:18:15,570 --> 00:18:13,059 find something that will work just to 405 00:18:19,499 --> 00:18:15,580 keep it dry but also taking into account 406 00:18:22,049 --> 00:18:19,509 real-world situations and then we we 407 00:18:25,680 --> 00:18:22,059 pour in lots and lots of water and we 408 00:18:28,379 --> 00:18:25,690 see what happens so we make it pretty 409 00:18:30,389 --> 00:18:28,389 easy to do it kind of level one because 410 00:18:31,889 --> 00:18:30,399 we want to encourage success but then we 411 00:18:34,619 --> 00:18:31,899 make it progressively harder and make 412 00:18:36,320 --> 00:18:34,629 them take into account progressively 413 00:18:39,119 --> 00:18:36,330 more variables that they might have to 414 00:18:41,100 --> 00:18:39,129 encounter so it's a way of thinking 415 00:18:42,239 --> 00:18:41,110 about science it's a way of going 416 00:18:44,249 --> 00:18:42,249 through the engineering design process 417 00:18:46,680 --> 00:18:44,259 and most importantly it's a way about 418 00:18:47,999 --> 00:18:46,690 fine to think about finding solutions to 419 00:18:48,749 --> 00:18:48,009 climate change and having a bit of fun 420 00:18:50,340 --> 00:18:48,759 along the way 421 00:18:52,049 --> 00:18:50,350 well hopefully and making a huge mess 422 00:18:53,879 --> 00:18:52,059 and making a huge mess now you're 423 00:18:56,999 --> 00:18:53,889 involved with coming up with these 424 00:19:00,869 --> 00:18:57,009 concepts yes so that is the best part of 425 00:19:03,060 --> 00:19:00,879 my job maybe probably it's really fun I 426 00:19:05,009 --> 00:19:03,070 get to play with arts and crafts and I 427 00:19:07,619 --> 00:19:05,019 get to take more trips to Michael's than 428 00:19:09,509 --> 00:19:07,629 ever before in my life now Michaels is 429 00:19:12,899 --> 00:19:09,519 for international listeners what's that 430 00:19:17,220 --> 00:19:12,909 it's an arts and crafts store yes with 431 00:19:18,960 --> 00:19:17,230 you now and so folks look where there'll 432 00:19:22,379 --> 00:19:18,970 be a link in the weeks this week's show 433 00:19:24,119 --> 00:19:22,389 notes of course but it's in C is calm 434 00:19:26,520 --> 00:19:24,129 and when you go there at the top of the 435 00:19:28,200 --> 00:19:26,530 page there's a little YouTube 436 00:19:29,930 --> 00:19:28,210 go little icon click that and you can 437 00:19:32,220 --> 00:19:29,940 see all the wonderful and fun videos 438 00:19:34,470 --> 00:19:32,230 that everybody here is put out 439 00:19:36,650 --> 00:19:34,480 especially by Kate and Drake you to 440 00:19:39,360 --> 00:19:36,660 those ones do you get to do much 441 00:19:41,640 --> 00:19:39,370 traveling or you office bound more or 442 00:19:45,720 --> 00:19:41,650 less in this job um I travel out to 443 00:19:48,000 --> 00:19:45,730 conferences so I'm leaving you know I I 444 00:19:51,120 --> 00:19:48,010 do a lot of training and speaking about 445 00:19:53,490 --> 00:19:51,130 what we do so next week I'm going to the 446 00:19:56,250 --> 00:19:53,500 Smithsonian to talk about the no 447 00:19:58,770 --> 00:19:56,260 conflict approach with their volunteers 448 00:20:03,140 --> 00:19:58,780 and do some training with them and then 449 00:20:06,900 --> 00:20:03,150 somebody to carry about I'm very excited 450 00:20:10,020 --> 00:20:06,910 and I'm also spending some time in 451 00:20:12,930 --> 00:20:10,030 Portland at the end of this week going 452 00:20:16,170 --> 00:20:12,940 to a science communication conference so 453 00:20:18,120 --> 00:20:16,180 I'm talking about one of the one of the 454 00:20:21,390 --> 00:20:18,130 biggest and the coolest problems that 455 00:20:23,690 --> 00:20:21,400 I've been working with which is I'm how 456 00:20:26,970 --> 00:20:23,700 do you engage people who have you know 457 00:20:29,550 --> 00:20:26,980 CRISPR or something you know really 458 00:20:31,380 --> 00:20:29,560 pulled from the headlines but maybe they 459 00:20:35,160 --> 00:20:31,390 had a high school biology class twenty 460 00:20:37,560 --> 00:20:35,170 years ago and how do you have helped 461 00:20:40,020 --> 00:20:37,570 them find an engaging answer to a 462 00:20:43,740 --> 00:20:40,030 question when they don't really have the 463 00:20:47,100 --> 00:20:43,750 background to they have they're missing 464 00:20:48,480 --> 00:20:47,110 you know 20 steps so that is something 465 00:20:50,400 --> 00:20:48,490 that I've been working with especially 466 00:20:53,730 --> 00:20:50,410 when I do outreach geared toward adults 467 00:20:58,290 --> 00:20:53,740 and I'm gonna go over some different 468 00:21:00,480 --> 00:20:58,300 strategies so finding where they are and 469 00:21:01,650 --> 00:21:00,490 kind of really making a connection with 470 00:21:05,040 --> 00:21:01,660 who they are and where they're coming 471 00:21:07,080 --> 00:21:05,050 from and also really creating what in 472 00:21:09,990 --> 00:21:07,090 the pedagogy world is kind of a 473 00:21:11,640 --> 00:21:10,000 problem-based learning environment so if 474 00:21:13,500 --> 00:21:11,650 you actually get them invested in 475 00:21:16,380 --> 00:21:13,510 solving a problem or living through an 476 00:21:19,020 --> 00:21:16,390 experience then you can really tailor 477 00:21:21,660 --> 00:21:19,030 their specific interests and their 478 00:21:24,510 --> 00:21:21,670 background - you can tailor their 479 00:21:29,220 --> 00:21:24,520 learning to that so rather than having 480 00:21:34,050 --> 00:21:29,230 to talk at them about what is DNA which 481 00:21:37,080 --> 00:21:34,060 most people don't know you can get them 482 00:21:39,810 --> 00:21:37,090 involved in solving a problem and they 483 00:21:40,399 --> 00:21:39,820 can maybe accidentally learn about what 484 00:21:43,710 --> 00:21:40,409 it is 485 00:21:46,049 --> 00:21:43,720 but it's more a process of kind of 486 00:21:47,880 --> 00:21:46,059 self-discovery interesting what you say 487 00:21:50,880 --> 00:21:47,890 about DNA you say what most people don't 488 00:21:52,649 --> 00:21:50,890 know yes of course they don't and I come 489 00:21:56,070 --> 00:21:52,659 across this too and then my second 490 00:21:57,779 --> 00:21:56,080 thought is well why why why would they 491 00:21:59,580 --> 00:21:57,789 but most people go about their daily 492 00:22:01,500 --> 00:21:59,590 lives not knowing about a lot of things 493 00:22:05,190 --> 00:22:01,510 now that probably everybody has heard 494 00:22:06,990 --> 00:22:05,200 the term DNA and now you can get DNA 495 00:22:08,940 --> 00:22:07,000 tests and people realize that it's 496 00:22:11,340 --> 00:22:08,950 something to do with like a fingerprint 497 00:22:14,340 --> 00:22:11,350 answer but the complexity of it and the 498 00:22:17,430 --> 00:22:14,350 double helix in the RNA no no I mean 499 00:22:18,899 --> 00:22:17,440 your average person on the street might 500 00:22:21,180 --> 00:22:18,909 not have that knowledge and I wouldn't 501 00:22:24,720 --> 00:22:21,190 be too down on them for not having it so 502 00:22:27,419 --> 00:22:24,730 I guess yeah you have a lot of Education 503 00:22:29,279 --> 00:22:27,429 to do don't you great well I mean when 504 00:22:33,629 --> 00:22:29,289 you when people talk to me about their 505 00:22:36,269 --> 00:22:33,639 23andme results they say things like I'm 506 00:22:38,789 --> 00:22:36,279 two percent Neanderthal and then they 507 00:22:41,070 --> 00:22:38,799 you know I've had people point to the 508 00:22:42,509 --> 00:22:41,080 part of themselves that's the two 509 00:22:45,029 --> 00:22:42,519 percent of my body that's new 510 00:22:49,980 --> 00:22:45,039 oh yeah what yeah of course I think my 511 00:22:51,680 --> 00:22:49,990 big toe might be there you go well 512 00:22:54,149 --> 00:22:51,690 that's interesting 513 00:22:54,840 --> 00:22:54,159 expresses itself at one particular yeah 514 00:22:57,210 --> 00:22:54,850 Wow 515 00:22:59,070 --> 00:22:57,220 well because if you've done a DNA test 516 00:23:00,320 --> 00:22:59,080 but you don't have any fundamental 517 00:23:02,940 --> 00:23:00,330 understanding of how it works 518 00:23:05,460 --> 00:23:02,950 another thing we do is we go to we were 519 00:23:08,399 --> 00:23:05,470 at the State Fair and we extracted DNA 520 00:23:12,360 --> 00:23:08,409 from from applesauce 521 00:23:15,120 --> 00:23:12,370 right okay yes yeah this is super easy 522 00:23:16,980 --> 00:23:15,130 activity so one of the really surprising 523 00:23:20,519 --> 00:23:16,990 questions that I got and I was kind of 524 00:23:22,560 --> 00:23:20,529 taken aback by that is someone was like 525 00:23:24,899 --> 00:23:22,570 so there's DNA in there and I was like 526 00:23:29,009 --> 00:23:24,909 yes most food has DNA in it and they're 527 00:23:31,259 --> 00:23:29,019 like so if I eat applesauce I'm eating 528 00:23:33,629 --> 00:23:31,269 DNA and it was like yes but that's true 529 00:23:37,919 --> 00:23:33,639 of all the food that you eat so I'm part 530 00:23:43,620 --> 00:23:41,220 it is funny I had to try really hard not 531 00:23:45,149 --> 00:23:43,630 to laugh when it was asked but it does 532 00:23:47,519 --> 00:23:45,159 you know that's that's actually thinking 533 00:23:49,529 --> 00:23:47,529 like a scientist and again it gets back 534 00:23:50,820 --> 00:23:49,539 to the point well why does it why should 535 00:23:53,159 --> 00:23:50,830 people in the street know the 536 00:23:54,330 --> 00:23:53,169 complexities of it but they have to live 537 00:23:57,600 --> 00:23:54,340 in a world where 538 00:23:59,760 --> 00:23:57,610 or people are talking about the 539 00:24:01,409 --> 00:23:59,770 complexities of it they have to live in 540 00:24:03,450 --> 00:24:01,419 a world where they're voting for 541 00:24:05,840 --> 00:24:03,460 politicians who have opinions on it and 542 00:24:08,250 --> 00:24:05,850 they're supposed to be you know there is 543 00:24:11,130 --> 00:24:08,260 science knowledge based on science 544 00:24:12,810 --> 00:24:11,140 science knowledge is it's becoming more 545 00:24:16,140 --> 00:24:12,820 and more important for living in this 546 00:24:18,180 --> 00:24:16,150 world why I have to agree I have to 547 00:24:19,740 --> 00:24:18,190 agree with you there and the more people 548 00:24:22,380 --> 00:24:19,750 like you who can get out there and 549 00:24:23,130 --> 00:24:22,390 communicate science and make it fun make 550 00:24:26,190 --> 00:24:23,140 it interesting 551 00:24:28,710 --> 00:24:26,200 make it stick maybe didn't don't make it 552 00:24:31,529 --> 00:24:28,720 scary I think is a wonderful thing well 553 00:24:33,779 --> 00:24:31,539 folks again ice directly to the National 554 00:24:35,370 --> 00:24:33,789 Center for Science education links in 555 00:24:37,409 --> 00:24:35,380 this week's show notes don't forget to 556 00:24:39,659 --> 00:24:37,419 check out the videos especially by the 557 00:24:43,440 --> 00:24:39,669 ones of Cape Cara the director of 558 00:24:45,180 --> 00:24:43,450 community science education Kate a real 559 00:24:47,519 --> 00:24:45,190 pleasure to spend some time with you 560 00:24:50,100 --> 00:24:47,529 here in the wonderful library complete 561 00:24:53,159 --> 00:24:50,110 with books and skulls and I look forward 562 00:24:54,240 --> 00:24:53,169 to maybe interviewing you down the track 563 00:25:10,560 --> 00:24:54,250 to see how things are going 564 00:25:16,480 --> 00:25:13,930 calling all skeptics or listeners the 565 00:25:18,820 --> 00:25:16,490 aleph end or near Glasgow are are you 566 00:25:21,100 --> 00:25:18,830 planning to visit sometime then you're 567 00:25:24,580 --> 00:25:21,110 in luck because the Glasgow skeptics 568 00:25:25,840 --> 00:25:24,590 have got your Monday nights sorted we 569 00:25:28,570 --> 00:25:25,850 are committed to filling up every 570 00:25:31,270 --> 00:25:28,580 available Monday night talks on science 571 00:25:33,399 --> 00:25:31,280 and skepticism past speakers include 572 00:25:34,630 --> 00:25:33,409 Eugenie Scott Jerry Coyne make up 573 00:25:36,669 --> 00:25:34,640 Marshall Nate Phelps 574 00:25:40,060 --> 00:25:36,679 tormund Cecil from cognitive dissonance 575 00:25:42,220 --> 00:25:40,070 PZ Myers Richard Wiseman EC drilling 576 00:25:45,250 --> 00:25:42,230 Noah Heath and Eli from the scathing 577 00:25:47,500 --> 00:25:45,260 atheist Simon Singh Rebecca Watson and a 578 00:25:49,870 --> 00:25:47,510 multitude of local academics and 579 00:25:51,940 --> 00:25:49,880 skeptics there's literally nothing 580 00:25:54,279 --> 00:25:51,950 better you can do on a Monday night in 581 00:25:57,100 --> 00:25:54,289 Glasgow it doesn't involve taking your 582 00:25:59,289 --> 00:25:57,110 clothes off so come join us we've also 583 00:26:01,510 --> 00:25:59,299 got a vibrant online community you can 584 00:26:03,789 --> 00:26:01,520 find us on Facebook Twitter and get 585 00:26:18,529 --> 00:26:03,799 involved with the discussion Glasgow 586 00:26:31,200 --> 00:26:22,499 it's the raw skeptic report with Heidi 587 00:26:33,509 --> 00:26:31,210 Robertson hello everyone 588 00:26:39,180 --> 00:26:33,519 Heidi Robertson here from the Northern 589 00:26:41,690 --> 00:26:39,190 Rivers vaccination supporters so I was 590 00:26:44,749 --> 00:26:41,700 procrastinating a couple of days ago 591 00:26:48,480 --> 00:26:44,759 just scrolling through my Facebook feed 592 00:26:51,450 --> 00:26:48,490 when a post by asthma Australia caught 593 00:26:53,759 --> 00:26:51,460 my attention the asthma Australia 594 00:26:56,159 --> 00:26:53,769 website is a legitimate and 595 00:26:59,100 --> 00:26:56,169 well-respected source of information for 596 00:27:03,450 --> 00:26:59,110 people newly diagnosed or living with 597 00:27:06,960 --> 00:27:03,460 asthma asthma is not a minor ailment for 598 00:27:10,649 --> 00:27:06,970 many people in Australia and New Zealand 599 00:27:13,259 --> 00:27:10,659 there are around 1 in 8 or 9 people 600 00:27:16,169 --> 00:27:13,269 living with asthma and thousands are 601 00:27:19,649 --> 00:27:16,179 hospitalized every year and some of 602 00:27:22,320 --> 00:27:19,659 those asthma attacks are fatal asthma 603 00:27:24,740 --> 00:27:22,330 has many triggers which can be different 604 00:27:28,619 --> 00:27:24,750 for each person that has the diagnosis 605 00:27:31,889 --> 00:27:28,629 exercise pollen dust mold and smoke our 606 00:27:36,180 --> 00:27:31,899 common triggers and so are strong scents 607 00:27:38,190 --> 00:27:36,190 like perfume or deodorants the Facebook 608 00:27:40,860 --> 00:27:38,200 post that caught my eye links readers to 609 00:27:44,549 --> 00:27:40,870 an article by Kirsty wind in the New 610 00:27:46,560 --> 00:27:44,559 Zealand Herald titled father threatens 611 00:27:49,950 --> 00:27:46,570 legal action if school keeps using 612 00:27:55,110 --> 00:27:49,960 essential oils in class and it's dated 613 00:27:58,110 --> 00:27:55,120 the 30th of March 2019 but before I go 614 00:28:02,310 --> 00:27:58,120 on to quote the article what exactly is 615 00:28:05,759 --> 00:28:02,320 an essential oil turns out that it is 616 00:28:08,100 --> 00:28:05,769 not an oil that is essential the 617 00:28:10,139 --> 00:28:08,110 essential part of essential oil means 618 00:28:13,019 --> 00:28:10,149 that it contains the essence of the 619 00:28:15,869 --> 00:28:13,029 plant from which it is derived it is a 620 00:28:18,560 --> 00:28:15,879 concentrated liquid extracted from a 621 00:28:21,060 --> 00:28:18,570 particular plant and often used for 622 00:28:23,030 --> 00:28:21,070 aromatherapy a form of alternative 623 00:28:25,590 --> 00:28:23,040 medicine 624 00:28:27,990 --> 00:28:25,600 essential oils have been described by 625 00:28:30,480 --> 00:28:28,000 their proponents as being useful in 626 00:28:33,240 --> 00:28:30,490 preventing or treating disease and other 627 00:28:37,470 --> 00:28:33,250 ailments although there is little 628 00:28:40,110 --> 00:28:37,480 scientific evidence to back this up the 629 00:28:42,270 --> 00:28:40,120 multi marketing doTERRA company 630 00:28:45,410 --> 00:28:42,280 mentioned in the following article has 631 00:28:49,830 --> 00:28:45,420 four diffusers for sale on its website 632 00:28:52,560 --> 00:28:49,840 from $62 ranging through to one hundred 633 00:28:54,720 --> 00:28:52,570 and nineteen dollars to be used in 634 00:28:56,880 --> 00:28:54,730 conjunction with one or more of their 635 00:29:00,960 --> 00:28:56,890 essential oils priced at forty five 636 00:29:03,620 --> 00:29:00,970 dollars for 15 milliliters so with that 637 00:29:07,710 --> 00:29:03,630 bit of background on to the article 638 00:29:10,140 --> 00:29:07,720 quote an Auckland primary school has 639 00:29:12,960 --> 00:29:10,150 pulled therapeutic diffusers from the 640 00:29:15,480 --> 00:29:12,970 classroom after a high court threat from 641 00:29:18,650 --> 00:29:15,490 a parent who said the essential oils 642 00:29:21,360 --> 00:29:18,660 could trigger asthma attacks on 643 00:29:24,810 --> 00:29:21,370 Wednesday Milford primary school on 644 00:29:27,060 --> 00:29:24,820 Auckland's North Shore put diffusers in 645 00:29:30,240 --> 00:29:27,070 twenty classrooms with oil blends 646 00:29:32,880 --> 00:29:30,250 designed to quote stop the spread of 647 00:29:34,520 --> 00:29:32,890 viruses and keep children focused at 648 00:29:37,410 --> 00:29:34,530 school end quote 649 00:29:39,870 --> 00:29:37,420 that evening the school board received a 650 00:29:43,640 --> 00:29:39,880 letter threatening high court action 651 00:29:46,680 --> 00:29:43,650 from a parent who is also a lawyer 652 00:29:49,200 --> 00:29:46,690 Auckland barrister Tim Rainey who has a 653 00:29:51,420 --> 00:29:49,210 son at the school said he took action 654 00:29:53,400 --> 00:29:51,430 because there was no consultation with 655 00:29:57,360 --> 00:29:53,410 parents before the decision was made to 656 00:29:59,220 --> 00:29:57,370 use diffusers in the classrooms he spoke 657 00:30:01,830 --> 00:29:59,230 to his son's teacher on Wednesday 658 00:30:06,450 --> 00:30:01,840 morning and she agreed not to use the 659 00:30:08,670 --> 00:30:06,460 diffuser in class that day but he said 660 00:30:10,950 --> 00:30:08,680 it was not a long-term solution and had 661 00:30:13,980 --> 00:30:10,960 spoken to other parents who were also 662 00:30:16,020 --> 00:30:13,990 concerned Rainey said that the first he 663 00:30:18,300 --> 00:30:16,030 heard of the diffusers was in a 664 00:30:20,280 --> 00:30:18,310 newsletter earlier in the month that 665 00:30:23,760 --> 00:30:20,290 said there would be an information 666 00:30:26,580 --> 00:30:23,770 evening about the product the diffusers 667 00:30:29,580 --> 00:30:26,590 and oils supplied by multi-level 668 00:30:32,130 --> 00:30:29,590 marketing business doTERRA work by 669 00:30:35,010 --> 00:30:32,140 dispersing a mist of water and essential 670 00:30:37,430 --> 00:30:35,020 oils into the air to be inhaled and 671 00:30:40,140 --> 00:30:37,440 easily absorbed by the body 672 00:30:42,210 --> 00:30:40,150 this decision has been made without any 673 00:30:44,280 --> 00:30:42,220 consultation with parents and without 674 00:30:48,570 --> 00:30:44,290 obtaining parental consent 675 00:30:51,270 --> 00:30:48,580 he said Rainey said some essential oils 676 00:30:53,850 --> 00:30:51,280 such as wild orange and a cinnamon bark 677 00:30:56,580 --> 00:30:53,860 used in the doTERRA OnGuard 678 00:30:59,970 --> 00:30:56,590 blend were irritants for people with 679 00:31:00,930 --> 00:30:59,980 allergies and asthma in a letter to the 680 00:31:03,750 --> 00:31:00,940 Board of Trustees 681 00:31:07,320 --> 00:31:03,760 Rainie said he wanted the diffusers 682 00:31:09,120 --> 00:31:07,330 removed immediately quote if the board 683 00:31:11,430 --> 00:31:09,130 is not prepared to confirm that this 684 00:31:14,310 --> 00:31:11,440 experiment will cease by 9:00 a.m. 685 00:31:16,950 --> 00:31:14,320 tomorrow I will commence proceedings in 686 00:31:19,500 --> 00:31:16,960 the High Court seeking an injunction to 687 00:31:21,419 --> 00:31:19,510 restrain the school from continuing to 688 00:31:25,530 --> 00:31:21,429 expose students to this risk 689 00:31:28,080 --> 00:31:25,540 end quote he stated quote given the 690 00:31:32,580 --> 00:31:28,090 urgency of the situation I may make that 691 00:31:34,530 --> 00:31:32,590 application without notice and quote he 692 00:31:36,690 --> 00:31:34,540 said the school's decision to use oils 693 00:31:39,180 --> 00:31:36,700 that could harm one student to help 694 00:31:40,770 --> 00:31:39,190 others was the same as quote making 695 00:31:43,290 --> 00:31:40,780 everyone eat a peanut butter sandwich 696 00:31:45,410 --> 00:31:43,300 because someone said it was brain food 697 00:31:48,570 --> 00:31:45,420 end quote 698 00:31:50,760 --> 00:31:48,580 neither the school nor I have any idea 699 00:31:52,830 --> 00:31:50,770 what effect the use of these essential 700 00:31:57,780 --> 00:31:52,840 oils will have on him or any of his 701 00:32:00,450 --> 00:31:57,790 classmates he said at a PTA meeting in 702 00:32:02,700 --> 00:32:00,460 March this year two thousand dollars was 703 00:32:04,710 --> 00:32:02,710 approved to purchase twenty two fuses 704 00:32:08,940 --> 00:32:04,720 and two different blends of essential 705 00:32:12,450 --> 00:32:08,950 oils from doTERRA school principal sue 706 00:32:14,490 --> 00:32:12,460 Cottle told The Weeknd Herald the legal 707 00:32:18,299 --> 00:32:14,500 letter was the first negative contact 708 00:32:20,549 --> 00:32:18,309 she had regarding the diffusers quote we 709 00:32:23,160 --> 00:32:20,559 trialed the diffusers in one class last 710 00:32:25,260 --> 00:32:23,170 year and that class had fewer students 711 00:32:28,740 --> 00:32:25,270 off sick and the teacher said the 712 00:32:30,510 --> 00:32:28,750 behavior had improved she said we want 713 00:32:32,669 --> 00:32:30,520 to stop the spread of illness and have 714 00:32:36,060 --> 00:32:32,679 children in the class learning not at 715 00:32:37,980 --> 00:32:36,070 home sick and quote she said other 716 00:32:40,290 --> 00:32:37,990 schools used the diffusers with no issue 717 00:32:43,500 --> 00:32:40,300 and she had cleared the use with the 718 00:32:45,270 --> 00:32:43,510 Ministry of Education Kartell said the 719 00:32:47,850 --> 00:32:45,280 diffusers were now locked away in an 720 00:32:49,370 --> 00:32:47,860 office until the board decided what to 721 00:32:52,530 --> 00:32:49,380 do next 722 00:32:54,900 --> 00:32:52,540 the teachers were behind the use 100% 723 00:32:57,060 --> 00:32:54,910 and so many parents have told me they 724 00:32:59,430 --> 00:32:57,070 loved the idea of the diffusers in class 725 00:33:03,300 --> 00:32:59,440 there was so much positive feedback and 726 00:33:05,580 --> 00:33:03,310 quote she said but no school wants the 727 00:33:08,460 --> 00:33:05,590 threat of legal action so we pulled them 728 00:33:10,430 --> 00:33:08,470 straight away we have other battles end 729 00:33:14,370 --> 00:33:10,440 quote 730 00:33:16,860 --> 00:33:14,380 and that's the end of the article one of 731 00:33:18,540 --> 00:33:16,870 the things that stood out for me was the 732 00:33:20,430 --> 00:33:18,550 apparent presumption both in the 733 00:33:23,550 --> 00:33:20,440 comments section of the Facebook post 734 00:33:25,620 --> 00:33:23,560 and the article itself that essential 735 00:33:27,750 --> 00:33:25,630 oil diffusers were in fact effective as 736 00:33:29,880 --> 00:33:27,760 a way of as the principal was quoted as 737 00:33:32,990 --> 00:33:29,890 saying stopping the spread of viruses 738 00:33:36,120 --> 00:33:33,000 and keeping children focused at school 739 00:33:37,980 --> 00:33:36,130 this was their starting point and nobody 740 00:33:41,430 --> 00:33:37,990 was questioning the veracity or 741 00:33:43,800 --> 00:33:41,440 plausibility of it so I went on a bit of 742 00:33:46,470 --> 00:33:43,810 a hunt and thus began my journey down a 743 00:33:49,260 --> 00:33:46,480 convoluted rabbit hole and the end 744 00:33:52,530 --> 00:33:49,270 result was that there have been studies 745 00:33:54,830 --> 00:33:52,540 in vitro of various essential oils 746 00:33:58,800 --> 00:33:54,840 potentially having some antimicrobial 747 00:34:03,290 --> 00:33:58,810 effects but no human clinical trials of 748 00:34:06,780 --> 00:34:03,300 this particular blend of diffused oil 749 00:34:09,810 --> 00:34:06,790 now bear with me while I go off on a bit 750 00:34:11,610 --> 00:34:09,820 of a tangent here because as I was 751 00:34:15,419 --> 00:34:11,620 looking into this story I found a couple 752 00:34:17,369 --> 00:34:15,429 of extra interesting tidbits doterra 753 00:34:20,070 --> 00:34:17,379 have their headquarters in Utah and the 754 00:34:23,490 --> 00:34:20,080 United States and officers and 755 00:34:26,010 --> 00:34:23,500 distributors worldwide the chairman of 756 00:34:28,950 --> 00:34:26,020 the scientific advisory committee of 757 00:34:31,280 --> 00:34:28,960 doTERRA is a chiropractor with a passion 758 00:34:34,020 --> 00:34:31,290 for essential oils 759 00:34:37,379 --> 00:34:34,030 he has just moved to a different branch 760 00:34:40,159 --> 00:34:37,389 of the company replaced with of all 761 00:34:43,500 --> 00:34:40,169 things and infectious diseases 762 00:34:45,930 --> 00:34:43,510 pediatrician this pediatrician will 763 00:34:48,440 --> 00:34:45,940 apparently be not only leading doe 764 00:34:51,570 --> 00:34:48,450 terrors health care and research teams 765 00:34:55,169 --> 00:34:51,580 but will also be senior medical director 766 00:34:58,350 --> 00:34:55,179 of doe terrors new prime meridian 767 00:35:02,670 --> 00:34:58,360 medical complex which will open this 768 00:35:07,020 --> 00:35:02,680 month April 2019 from doe terrors 769 00:35:10,650 --> 00:35:07,030 website quote the 41,000 square foot 770 00:35:12,570 --> 00:35:10,660 direct primary care facility located 771 00:35:15,060 --> 00:35:12,580 directly across the street from Doe 772 00:35:18,840 --> 00:35:15,070 terrors Global Campus in Pleasant Grove 773 00:35:22,290 --> 00:35:18,850 Utah will be open to the public in April 774 00:35:24,960 --> 00:35:22,300 2009 teen along with addressing those 775 00:35:28,350 --> 00:35:24,970 modern healthcare realities of long wait 776 00:35:30,660 --> 00:35:28,360 times scheduling difficulties and little 777 00:35:33,240 --> 00:35:30,670 time actually spent with your medical 778 00:35:36,660 --> 00:35:33,250 provider we are certain that the 779 00:35:39,900 --> 00:35:36,670 integrated approach to health based on 780 00:35:43,200 --> 00:35:39,910 the doTERRA wellness lifestyle pyramid 781 00:35:45,840 --> 00:35:43,210 will offer a breadth of essential oil 782 00:35:50,790 --> 00:35:45,850 infused fresh air and a better 783 00:35:54,810 --> 00:35:50,800 experience for patients end quote as one 784 00:35:55,650 --> 00:35:54,820 commenter on reddit said so let me get 785 00:35:58,440 --> 00:35:55,660 this straight 786 00:36:01,560 --> 00:35:58,450 infectious disease medical doctor is now 787 00:36:04,290 --> 00:36:01,570 chief medical officer for a multi-level 788 00:36:07,230 --> 00:36:04,300 marketing company that pedals essential 789 00:36:10,160 --> 00:36:07,240 oils and aromatherapy as medical cures 790 00:36:13,530 --> 00:36:10,170 for just about everything under the Sun 791 00:36:18,240 --> 00:36:13,540 except essential oils can't do through 792 00:36:23,040 --> 00:36:18,250 infectious diseases all the irony and 793 00:36:25,440 --> 00:36:23,050 quote indeed I'm sure we'll be hearing 794 00:36:28,590 --> 00:36:25,450 more about doTERRA and their new prime 795 00:36:29,940 --> 00:36:28,600 meridian venture in the future but in 796 00:36:32,360 --> 00:36:29,950 the meantime getting back to the 797 00:36:35,040 --> 00:36:32,370 original story of the new zealand school 798 00:36:37,200 --> 00:36:35,050 the particular blend that was to be used 799 00:36:38,510 --> 00:36:37,210 in the diffusers at school called 800 00:36:41,520 --> 00:36:38,520 OnGuard 801 00:36:43,290 --> 00:36:41,530 contains the essential oils of wild 802 00:36:46,320 --> 00:36:43,300 orange peel clove bud 803 00:36:50,130 --> 00:36:46,330 cinnamon leaf cinnamon bark eucalyptus 804 00:36:53,510 --> 00:36:50,140 leaf and rosemary leaf benefits as per 805 00:36:56,580 --> 00:36:53,520 the doTERRA website include quote 806 00:37:00,210 --> 00:36:56,590 supports healthy immune and respiratory 807 00:37:03,620 --> 00:37:00,220 function protects against environmental 808 00:37:07,050 --> 00:37:03,630 threats supports the body's natural 809 00:37:11,280 --> 00:37:07,060 antioxidant defenses promotes healthy 810 00:37:14,210 --> 00:37:11,290 circulation and has an energizing and 811 00:37:15,910 --> 00:37:14,220 uplifting aroma end quote 812 00:37:19,480 --> 00:37:15,920 there is 813 00:37:23,170 --> 00:37:19,490 asterisk after these listed benefits 814 00:37:25,000 --> 00:37:23,180 which points to a disclaimer quote these 815 00:37:26,890 --> 00:37:25,010 statements have not been evaluated by 816 00:37:28,660 --> 00:37:26,900 the Food and Drug Administration this 817 00:37:31,270 --> 00:37:28,670 product is not intended to diagnose 818 00:37:34,120 --> 00:37:31,280 treat cure or prevent any disease end 819 00:37:36,490 --> 00:37:34,130 quote now it would appear that that 820 00:37:40,000 --> 00:37:36,500 disclaimer was placed on the doTERRA 821 00:37:43,599 --> 00:37:40,010 website in multiple places after the FDA 822 00:37:47,440 --> 00:37:43,609 sent a lengthy warning letter to doTERRA 823 00:37:50,710 --> 00:37:47,450 international in 2014 and I'll quote a 824 00:37:52,030 --> 00:37:50,720 small part of that quote your 825 00:37:54,160 --> 00:37:52,040 consultants promotes your 826 00:37:56,710 --> 00:37:54,170 above-mentioned doTERRA essential oil 827 00:37:59,319 --> 00:37:56,720 products for conditions including but 828 00:38:02,710 --> 00:37:59,329 not limited to viral infections 829 00:38:06,960 --> 00:38:02,720 including Ebola bacterial infections 830 00:38:10,450 --> 00:38:06,970 cancer brain injury autism endometriosis 831 00:38:15,430 --> 00:38:10,460 Graves disease Alzheimer's disease tumor 832 00:38:18,609 --> 00:38:15,440 reduction a DD ADHD and other conditions 833 00:38:21,069 --> 00:38:18,619 that are not amenable to self diagnosis 834 00:38:23,710 --> 00:38:21,079 and treatment by individuals who are not 835 00:38:26,109 --> 00:38:23,720 medical practitioners end quote and 836 00:38:29,049 --> 00:38:26,119 further on in the same warning letter 837 00:38:31,210 --> 00:38:29,059 quote the cited violations in this 838 00:38:33,280 --> 00:38:31,220 letter should not be viewed to apply 839 00:38:35,289 --> 00:38:33,290 solely to the specific products 840 00:38:37,240 --> 00:38:35,299 mentioned in this letter it is your 841 00:38:39,670 --> 00:38:37,250 responsibility to ensure that all of 842 00:38:42,130 --> 00:38:39,680 your products are in compliance with all 843 00:38:44,620 --> 00:38:42,140 requirements of the Act and federal 844 00:38:47,620 --> 00:38:44,630 regulations you should take prompt 845 00:38:51,060 --> 00:38:47,630 action to correct the violations cited 846 00:38:53,800 --> 00:38:51,070 in this letter end quote 847 00:38:55,840 --> 00:38:53,810 but what about the teachers who said 848 00:38:58,090 --> 00:38:55,850 that children were better behaved and 849 00:39:00,550 --> 00:38:58,100 had less sick days during a trial run of 850 00:39:04,750 --> 00:39:00,560 the diffusor in one classroom the year 851 00:39:07,750 --> 00:39:04,760 before well that could be explained by 852 00:39:09,910 --> 00:39:07,760 observer bias the expectation that 853 00:39:11,680 --> 00:39:09,920 benefits will result when one is told 854 00:39:14,290 --> 00:39:11,690 that for example a product will have a 855 00:39:16,240 --> 00:39:14,300 positive effect there may have been an 856 00:39:18,220 --> 00:39:16,250 expectation on the teachers to report 857 00:39:20,050 --> 00:39:18,230 positive results if it were a person in 858 00:39:23,200 --> 00:39:20,060 authority such as the principal who was 859 00:39:25,990 --> 00:39:23,210 asking them to report back to her of 860 00:39:28,060 --> 00:39:26,000 course there are also the expected peaks 861 00:39:30,640 --> 00:39:28,070 and troughs of infectious disease 862 00:39:33,070 --> 00:39:30,650 throughout the year which could account 863 00:39:36,550 --> 00:39:33,080 for less children being off sick at any 864 00:39:40,510 --> 00:39:36,560 given time and I'm sure other factors 865 00:39:42,730 --> 00:39:40,520 not taken into consideration as we say 866 00:39:45,910 --> 00:39:42,740 all the time correlation does not equal 867 00:39:47,860 --> 00:39:45,920 causation and a trial run in one 868 00:39:50,260 --> 00:39:47,870 classroom with a handful of students 869 00:39:54,840 --> 00:39:50,270 does not make for a robust and solid 870 00:39:57,550 --> 00:39:54,850 argument in favor of essential oil use 871 00:40:00,940 --> 00:39:57,560 as morote acts are not the only danger 872 00:40:02,920 --> 00:40:00,950 from essential oil exposure it turns out 873 00:40:05,530 --> 00:40:02,930 that as a follow-up to the article in 874 00:40:09,220 --> 00:40:05,540 the online New Zealand Herald on the 875 00:40:11,560 --> 00:40:09,230 30th of March 2019 a New Zealand 876 00:40:13,420 --> 00:40:11,570 neurologist spoke up about the dangers 877 00:40:16,930 --> 00:40:13,430 of some essential oils triggering 878 00:40:20,200 --> 00:40:16,940 seizures in children with epilepsy quote 879 00:40:22,150 --> 00:40:20,210 professor Gareth Perry who is an officer 880 00:40:25,270 --> 00:40:22,160 of the New Zealand Order of Merit for 881 00:40:27,430 --> 00:40:25,280 services to neurology said eucalyptus 882 00:40:29,980 --> 00:40:27,440 oil and rosemary oil were just two of 883 00:40:31,180 --> 00:40:29,990 eleven essential oils that potentially 884 00:40:34,180 --> 00:40:31,190 caused seizures 885 00:40:35,500 --> 00:40:34,190 end quote it is concerning that a 886 00:40:38,860 --> 00:40:35,510 taxpayer-funded 887 00:40:41,880 --> 00:40:38,870 educational facility would jump on board 888 00:40:44,830 --> 00:40:41,890 the pseudoscience bandwagon spending 889 00:40:47,350 --> 00:40:44,840 $2,000 of pnc money on a probably 890 00:40:50,950 --> 00:40:47,360 ineffective and potentially dangerous 891 00:40:53,130 --> 00:40:50,960 product i personally applaud this parent 892 00:40:57,120 --> 00:40:53,140 who happened to also be a lawyer in 893 00:41:00,120 --> 00:40:57,130 confronting his son's school about it 894 00:41:02,640 --> 00:41:00,130 that's all from me for now thank you for 895 00:41:04,620 --> 00:41:02,650 listening this has been Heidi Robertson 896 00:41:13,490 --> 00:41:04,630 of the Northern Rivers vaccination 897 00:41:37,290 --> 00:41:34,440 www.export.gov pamela gay from astronomy 898 00:41:39,210 --> 00:41:37,300 cast each week Fraser Cain and I take 899 00:41:41,400 --> 00:41:39,220 our listeners on a fact-based journey 900 00:41:44,160 --> 00:41:41,410 through the cosmos with our weekly 901 00:41:46,920 --> 00:41:44,170 podcast we explain not just what we know 902 00:41:49,800 --> 00:41:46,930 but how we know what we know about this 903 00:41:52,260 --> 00:41:49,810 universe that we share check us out at 904 00:41:54,660 --> 00:41:52,270 astronomy cast calm and look for us in 905 00:42:13,319 --> 00:41:54,670 itunes google play and wherever you 906 00:42:18,999 --> 00:42:16,209 now we continue our series reports 907 00:42:21,009 --> 00:42:19,009 articles items interviews and stories 908 00:42:26,979 --> 00:42:21,019 from the skeptic magazine the journal 909 00:42:31,229 --> 00:42:26,989 from Australian skeptics this week we 910 00:42:38,499 --> 00:42:31,239 turn to volume nine number four from 911 00:42:41,319 --> 00:42:38,509 1989 so thirty years ago and it's a 912 00:42:48,180 --> 00:42:41,329 report that could have been written last 913 00:42:55,569 --> 00:42:48,190 week by Tim Mendham New Age festival the 914 00:42:58,239 --> 00:42:55,579 mind-body-spirit and the money Thursday 915 00:43:01,239 --> 00:42:58,249 November the 16th was an auspicious day 916 00:43:04,680 --> 00:43:01,249 for the New Age in Australia it marked 917 00:43:07,209 --> 00:43:04,690 the opening of the four-day festival for 918 00:43:09,249 --> 00:43:07,219 mind/body/spirit that is surely the 919 00:43:12,940 --> 00:43:09,259 largest gathering so far of New Age 920 00:43:14,799 --> 00:43:12,950 marketing yet held in this country held 921 00:43:16,900 --> 00:43:14,809 at Sydney's darling harbour exhibition 922 00:43:19,660 --> 00:43:16,910 centre the event brought together about 923 00:43:21,269 --> 00:43:19,670 a hundred and thirty exhibitors about 60 924 00:43:24,670 --> 00:43:21,279 free demonstrations of New Age 925 00:43:27,279 --> 00:43:24,680 lifestyles almost 40 lectures and 926 00:43:30,729 --> 00:43:27,289 workshop sessions and no doubt many 927 00:43:32,950 --> 00:43:30,739 new-age adherents and customers the 928 00:43:35,380 --> 00:43:32,960 organisers were expecting over 20,000 929 00:43:38,170 --> 00:43:35,390 visitors and it seems quite possible 930 00:43:40,390 --> 00:43:38,180 that this was achieved the range of 931 00:43:42,479 --> 00:43:40,400 exhibitors was great with about 40 932 00:43:44,890 --> 00:43:42,489 percent dedicated to various aspects of 933 00:43:47,620 --> 00:43:44,900 alternative health aromatherapy 934 00:43:50,019 --> 00:43:47,630 essential oils herbal cures vitamins 935 00:43:52,299 --> 00:43:50,029 galore massage pyramids crystal healing 936 00:43:56,019 --> 00:43:52,309 microbiotic iridology flotation tanks 937 00:43:59,739 --> 00:43:56,029 acupuncture including needless ear 938 00:44:05,109 --> 00:43:59,749 version energy balancing reflexology 939 00:44:08,259 --> 00:44:05,119 faith healing etc etc etc mixed in were 940 00:44:11,680 --> 00:44:08,269 a range of cults such as Perry Krishna 941 00:44:16,089 --> 00:44:11,690 each Anka several different schools 942 00:44:19,240 --> 00:44:16,099 yoga mirror Buddha spiritualists even 943 00:44:21,690 --> 00:44:19,250 the quaint Aetherius society which still 944 00:44:24,550 --> 00:44:21,700 after 35 years supports the quote 945 00:44:27,849 --> 00:44:24,560 teachings from other planets unquote 946 00:44:32,550 --> 00:44:27,859 transmitted from the quote cosmic 947 00:44:34,930 --> 00:44:32,560 masters end quote new and not so new-age 948 00:44:37,839 --> 00:44:34,940 motivational and philosophical groups 949 00:44:41,470 --> 00:44:37,849 were also there in number including the 950 00:44:44,440 --> 00:44:41,480 conflict resolution Network accelerated 951 00:44:47,579 --> 00:44:44,450 learning money & hué discovery 952 00:44:52,059 --> 00:44:47,589 foundation and rope Ithaca movement 953 00:44:54,970 --> 00:44:52,069 Swedenborgian 'z and even Scientology 954 00:44:56,710 --> 00:44:54,980 albeit in the guise of Dianetics mixed 955 00:44:59,740 --> 00:44:56,720 among all these were some strange 956 00:45:02,650 --> 00:44:59,750 bedfellows including Animal Liberation a 957 00:45:05,650 --> 00:45:02,660 company selling new-age capes another 958 00:45:07,900 --> 00:45:05,660 selling shower roses an unusually 959 00:45:10,720 --> 00:45:07,910 mundane and useful product for such a 960 00:45:13,720 --> 00:45:10,730 show another selling a compound to keep 961 00:45:16,540 --> 00:45:13,730 your spectacles from fogging up another 962 00:45:21,220 --> 00:45:16,550 with books on practical spirituality for 963 00:45:23,349 --> 00:45:21,230 children and on it goes if you wanted to 964 00:45:26,770 --> 00:45:23,359 you could outfit an entire New Age 965 00:45:30,220 --> 00:45:26,780 lifestyle on the one spot complete with 966 00:45:33,609 --> 00:45:30,230 pyramid hats crystals of every shape and 967 00:45:36,430 --> 00:45:33,619 style for every application enough pills 968 00:45:40,960 --> 00:45:36,440 to start your own shop in fact the 969 00:45:43,329 --> 00:45:40,970 diversity was mind-boggling and this is 970 00:45:46,800 --> 00:45:43,339 the problem so much at the exhibition 971 00:45:50,640 --> 00:45:46,810 lectures and demonstrations was mutually 972 00:45:53,290 --> 00:45:50,650 exclusive who runs your life the Stars 973 00:45:55,630 --> 00:45:53,300 disembodied spirits and guardian angels 974 00:45:59,829 --> 00:45:55,640 extraterrestrials dreams dolphins or 975 00:46:02,770 --> 00:45:59,839 dare I say it yourself all work proposed 976 00:46:05,500 --> 00:46:02,780 as the answer along with surefire means 977 00:46:07,450 --> 00:46:05,510 to propagate them how does this equate 978 00:46:10,480 --> 00:46:07,460 with the aims of animal liberation or 979 00:46:13,720 --> 00:46:10,490 Oscar Chow so the founder of rica who 980 00:46:15,430 --> 00:46:13,730 says quote if we start believing that we 981 00:46:17,859 --> 00:46:15,440 are the cause of our own world we are 982 00:46:21,370 --> 00:46:17,869 totally mistaken since we don't create 983 00:46:24,490 --> 00:46:21,380 anything not even how dreams end quote 984 00:46:25,390 --> 00:46:24,500 pity the poor environmentalists in the 985 00:46:27,490 --> 00:46:25,400 audience 986 00:46:29,320 --> 00:46:27,500 a visitor could fill an entire library 987 00:46:29,890 --> 00:46:29,330 with the brochures pamphlets books and 988 00:46:33,160 --> 00:46:29,900 booklets 989 00:46:35,830 --> 00:46:33,170 being handed out and very little if any 990 00:46:38,380 --> 00:46:35,840 printed on recycled paper everything 991 00:46:41,640 --> 00:46:38,390 from sad little photocopied single 992 00:46:44,590 --> 00:46:41,650 sheeta's to massive glossy colored tomes 993 00:46:47,050 --> 00:46:44,600 pity the poor dolphins who have to live 994 00:46:48,810 --> 00:46:47,060 in the chlorine polluted sea caused by 995 00:46:51,940 --> 00:46:48,820 the production of this lot 996 00:46:54,730 --> 00:46:51,950 my favorite however was the brochure 997 00:46:57,370 --> 00:46:54,740 promoting the Second World heelas 998 00:47:00,220 --> 00:46:57,380 Congress to be held in New Zealand which 999 00:47:02,710 --> 00:47:00,230 folded up into a pyramid shape if the 1000 00:47:05,650 --> 00:47:02,720 Congress doesn't help you then maybe the 1001 00:47:07,720 --> 00:47:05,660 brochure will certainly the visitors 1002 00:47:10,870 --> 00:47:07,730 didn't seem to mind the contradictions 1003 00:47:13,420 --> 00:47:10,880 listening to new-age music full of peace 1004 00:47:15,640 --> 00:47:13,430 and light followed by a demonstration of 1005 00:47:19,410 --> 00:47:15,650 how you can train your kids to jump on 1006 00:47:22,330 --> 00:47:19,420 people with Taekwondo wearing a wire 1007 00:47:25,480 --> 00:47:22,340 arrangement on your head and taking part 1008 00:47:28,630 --> 00:47:25,490 in self-healing workshop the aisles were 1009 00:47:31,030 --> 00:47:28,640 full of potential customers all ages 1010 00:47:34,150 --> 00:47:31,040 were present young and innocent the old 1011 00:47:36,390 --> 00:47:34,160 and willing and no doubt a few trying to 1012 00:47:38,710 --> 00:47:36,400 solve the problems of their past lives 1013 00:47:42,400 --> 00:47:38,720 there was something for everyone 1014 00:47:44,320 --> 00:47:42,410 in fact in true new-age style everything 1015 00:47:46,900 --> 00:47:44,330 was there for everyone 1016 00:47:48,550 --> 00:47:46,910 Richard Glover began one of his reports 1017 00:47:50,800 --> 00:47:48,560 in The Sydney Morning Herald November 1018 00:47:53,710 --> 00:47:50,810 the 24th with a quotation from the 1019 00:47:55,720 --> 00:47:53,720 notice board of a Sydney Church quote we 1020 00:47:57,990 --> 00:47:55,730 can't build a good society just on 1021 00:48:00,490 --> 00:47:58,000 selfishness and tolerance unquote 1022 00:48:03,100 --> 00:48:00,500 initially confused by what appeared to 1023 00:48:06,820 --> 00:48:03,110 be opposites it dawned on him that the 1024 00:48:10,320 --> 00:48:06,830 message applied to the new-age tolerance 1025 00:48:13,690 --> 00:48:10,330 was the key word anything goes 1026 00:48:17,200 --> 00:48:13,700 regardless of how silly pointless or how 1027 00:48:19,570 --> 00:48:17,210 mutually exclusive new ages despite 1028 00:48:22,930 --> 00:48:19,580 their concerns for the well-being of the 1029 00:48:26,110 --> 00:48:22,940 world upon which they live one of their 1030 00:48:29,190 --> 00:48:26,120 magazines is called the planet really 1031 00:48:32,790 --> 00:48:29,200 more interested in self self healing 1032 00:48:35,650 --> 00:48:32,800 self-acceptance revealing your destiny 1033 00:48:38,630 --> 00:48:35,660 transforming your life secrets of the 1034 00:48:41,450 --> 00:48:38,640 inner self remembering your past lives 1035 00:48:44,390 --> 00:48:41,460 all of these phrases taken from titles 1036 00:48:47,349 --> 00:48:44,400 of workshop sessions admittedly there 1037 00:48:49,839 --> 00:48:47,359 were mixed in talks on our 1038 00:48:54,289 --> 00:48:49,849 responsibility to the environment a 1039 00:48:58,089 --> 00:48:54,299 vision of global healing earth repair 1040 00:49:01,519 --> 00:48:58,099 action and revolution for world peace 1041 00:49:04,160 --> 00:49:01,529 but as at least some of these involved 1042 00:49:07,279 --> 00:49:04,170 self healing and a program from the 1043 00:49:10,279 --> 00:49:07,289 people who talk to squirrels what hope 1044 00:49:13,670 --> 00:49:10,289 is there the organizers of the festival 1045 00:49:14,690 --> 00:49:13,680 of mind body spirit can be congratulated 1046 00:49:17,479 --> 00:49:14,700 for putting together a 1047 00:49:19,880 --> 00:49:17,489 professional-looking show it should be 1048 00:49:22,009 --> 00:49:19,890 as it is an offshoot of similar events 1049 00:49:26,089 --> 00:49:22,019 which have been going on in the UK and 1050 00:49:29,329 --> 00:49:26,099 elsewhere since 1977 the $6 entry fee 1051 00:49:31,239 --> 00:49:29,339 was not too expensive and despite the 1052 00:49:35,120 --> 00:49:31,249 media coverage which seemed to be 1053 00:49:38,269 --> 00:49:35,130 without exception cynical and/or mocking 1054 00:49:41,029 --> 00:49:38,279 the followers were out in force there is 1055 00:49:43,120 --> 00:49:41,039 no indication how well the exhibitors 1056 00:49:46,160 --> 00:49:43,130 lecturers and workshop holders did 1057 00:49:48,650 --> 00:49:46,170 probably very well if numbers are any 1058 00:49:52,160 --> 00:49:48,660 indication they probably did a lot 1059 00:49:54,900 --> 00:49:52,170 better than the ethiopians but then they 1060 00:49:58,270 --> 00:49:54,910 weren't exhibiting 1061 00:50:02,020 --> 00:49:58,280 and that story was new-age festival for 1062 00:50:04,630 --> 00:50:02,030 mind body spirit and money by Tim 1063 00:50:08,620 --> 00:50:04,640 Mendham and you can find that in the 1064 00:50:14,440 --> 00:50:08,630 skeptic magazine vol 9 number 4 from 1065 00:50:33,700 --> 00:50:14,450 1989 and that's available at WWF Dexcom 1066 00:50:35,650 --> 00:50:33,710 Ju thank you for listening to the 1067 00:50:38,080 --> 00:50:35,660 skeptics ode now our friends in Canberra 1068 00:50:40,510 --> 00:50:38,090 social skeptics Canberra group 1069 00:50:43,180 --> 00:50:40,520 remind me that their next meeting will 1070 00:50:47,170 --> 00:50:43,190 be on Tuesday the 16th of April from 6 1071 00:50:49,330 --> 00:50:47,180 to 7:30 p.m. at the Belconnen community 1072 00:50:53,550 --> 00:50:49,340 service which is in Chandler Street 1073 00:50:56,470 --> 00:50:53,560 Belconnen may the odds be in your favor 1074 00:50:59,590 --> 00:50:56,480 superstitions and elite athletes this 1075 00:51:03,820 --> 00:50:59,600 will be a talk by Christine done and the 1076 00:51:06,400 --> 00:51:03,830 cost is free elite sport has a healthy 1077 00:51:07,080 --> 00:51:06,410 dose of uncertainty and the stakes are 1078 00:51:09,520 --> 00:51:07,090 high 1079 00:51:11,800 --> 00:51:09,530 athletes train hard to prepare mentally 1080 00:51:16,480 --> 00:51:11,810 and physically to perform on the world 1081 00:51:20,050 --> 00:51:16,490 stage learning to manage anxiety to get 1082 00:51:22,720 --> 00:51:20,060 in the zone may be the skeptic zone is 1083 00:51:26,020 --> 00:51:22,730 one way that sports psychologists help 1084 00:51:28,900 --> 00:51:26,030 athletes but why do athletes some 1085 00:51:31,630 --> 00:51:28,910 athletes hold superstitions wherever 1086 00:51:33,280 --> 00:51:31,640 they help or not this sounds like an 1087 00:51:35,950 --> 00:51:33,290 absolutely fascinating talk and you can 1088 00:51:39,490 --> 00:51:35,960 find out more by visiting Canberra 1089 00:51:42,130 --> 00:51:39,500 skeptics org and I will link to the meet 1090 00:51:43,060 --> 00:51:42,140 up in this week's show notes coming up 1091 00:51:46,030 --> 00:51:43,070 on next week's show 1092 00:51:50,020 --> 00:51:46,040 Maynard at Sydney skeptics in the pub 1093 00:51:54,820 --> 00:51:50,030 and may not last the big question what 1094 00:51:56,700 --> 00:51:54,830 topics should skeptics drop what's been 1095 00:52:00,340 --> 00:51:56,710 done what should we no longer 1096 00:52:02,920 --> 00:52:00,350 concentrate on we get the views of 1097 00:52:04,960 --> 00:52:02,930 puppies that skeptics in the pub may nod 1098 00:52:06,530 --> 00:52:04,970 will also interview the speaker that 1099 00:52:10,370 --> 00:52:06,540 night carry Dodie 1100 00:52:13,640 --> 00:52:10,380 about the role Australia had in the 1101 00:52:15,950 --> 00:52:13,650 Apollo lunar program and what I didn't 1102 00:52:20,750 --> 00:52:15,960 know was Australia had a role a very 1103 00:52:23,090 --> 00:52:20,760 important role in the Apollo 13 incident 1104 00:52:25,160 --> 00:52:23,100 I hasten to add we didn't create it but 1105 00:52:27,410 --> 00:52:25,170 we hoped would he help to resolve it 1106 00:52:31,070 --> 00:52:27,420 also on next week's show a story about 1107 00:52:33,050 --> 00:52:31,080 psychic detectives well people who call 1108 00:52:35,330 --> 00:52:33,060 themselves psychic detectives in New 1109 00:52:38,900 --> 00:52:35,340 Zealand but for this week this is 1110 00:52:49,250 --> 00:52:38,910 Richard Saunders signing off from the 1111 00:52:52,040 --> 00:52:49,260 Twilight Zone you've been listening to 1112 00:52:56,810 --> 00:52:52,050 the skeptic Zone podcast please visit 1113 00:53:00,110 --> 00:52:56,820 our website at WWDC be for show notes 1114 00:53:04,160 --> 00:53:00,120 contacts and to access the bat catalog 1115 00:53:06,020 --> 00:53:04,170 of episodes going back to 2008 you can 1116 00:53:09,080 --> 00:53:06,030 follow the skeptic zone podcast on 1117 00:53:11,360 --> 00:53:09,090 twitter at skeptic zone visit our 1118 00:53:14,720 --> 00:53:11,370 facebook page or leave a review on 1119 00:53:18,110 --> 00:53:14,730 itunes you can also support the skeptic 1120 00:53:20,450 --> 00:53:18,120 zone via patreon or PayPal the skeptic 1121 00:53:22,400 --> 00:53:20,460 zone podcast is an independent 1122 00:53:24,590 --> 00:53:22,410 production reviews and opinions 1123 00:53:26,750 --> 00:53:24,600 expressed on the skeptic zone are not